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Thread: Amazingly similar cars

  1. #1
    Graham Keene
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    Amazingly similar cars

    I am undergoing a total restore of my 220S Cabriolet and I am amazed at how similar it is to the 190SL. The big difference is the chrome and wood trim vastness of the 220S. I feel very much at home with the 220S due to the similarity. Although only 2500 of these beauties were made, parts other than panels and chrome are bountiful due to the 190sl and the many other pontons produced. Perhaps I am still in the naive stage but this baby no longer scares me. John L's pictoral restoration of his 190sl really is helping me in my work...thanks again John. If I want a question answered for my 220S I search it on this site and usually get the answer I am looking for. I hope you don't mind me posting in the 190Sl general discussion...I did mention the 190Sl in this discussion didn't I.Click image for larger version. 

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    Graham Keene
    61 190Sl
    57 220S Cabriolet

  2. #2
    of the West Walter's Avatar
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    Yes any 220 is a step up in the complexity of the restoration process. Your cabriolet is a notch up from the sedan version (of which I have restored several and one lone ponton cabriolet.) It *IS* a LOT of work! Now just wait until you try your hand at a 300 version. Ditto that for a 190SL to a 300SL. It really ratchets up when you go between models. I suppose that is why I like the 190 ponton sedan so much, as it is just enough shiny stuff vs how complicated it is. You can restore a 190 sedan for down right almost cheap compared to the higher models and still have a pretty neat little car in the end. They are all stable mates and share lots of parts and that is a blessing too.

    Keep having fun!
    Walt in the West says: Don't ask: "Use the SEARCH Luke"
    1959 190SL DB050 with 333 leather blue ("It's Alive!" - 653 miles) Chassis 14445
    1961 300SL Roadster DB608 with red - fresh brakes and rebuilt engine hung in - more work coming!

  3. #3
    Graham Keene
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    Walter, the 190sl to 300sl is a mega step up for sure. I am not seeing any significant greater complexity on the body side of the 220S to the 190sl. What is a killer is the chrome the 15 or so wooden trim pieces to refinish (Heritage has mine now), and the 2 square miles of leather work. MY chrome and leather for the most part are very good. Electrical is almost identical with the exception of a 2 speed heater blower a rear interior light that is disabled when the top goes down. The front end, rear end, engine style, heating system, tranny, most door mechanisms and hardware are the same as the 190sl. I am trying to keep an open mind on the level of complexity but frankly it appears not to be as bad as I first thought. In fact, being able to remove the front fenders by removing the attachment bolts has really made the job easier than initially thought. I know the engine rework will be more expensive as there are two more pistons. Fortunately for me all I need is a rebuilt head, seals etc. I may be crying in a couple of months. I will keep you all posted.
    Graham Keene
    61 190Sl
    57 220S Cabriolet

  4. #4
    RonRapp
    Guest
    Well, I noticed you have removed "The real money pit" from the 220 listing. Congrats.

  5. #5
    2007 2018 Best of Show David Preston's Avatar
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    Graham,
    Thanks for the update on the 220s. Please keep sending us up dates. The sporty look of the 190SL and the 300SL are very unique. The full size convertible sedans Mercedes "hand built" have a distinctive classy look. My 280se 1970 is much newer but it has such a great feel and ride. I can't wait to see your 220s progress.
    David
    190 SL 60 Strawberry
    280 SL 69 Blue / Grey
    280 SE 69 Cabriolet Blk / Blk
    Corvette 67 Conv 327/350hp Red / Blk
    Porsche 912 67 Red/ Blk

  6. #6
    of the West Walter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Preston View Post
    My 280se 1970 is much newer but it has such a great feel and ride. I can't wait to see your 220s progress.
    Besides the year and body style the MAJOR difference between the later and earlier models *IS* the ride. The straight six SE engine, transmission, rear axle, and a lot of the brakes are just refinements. The whole later car is just so evolved from the ponton, you really feel it in the way the later car drives. It is like the difference between the early SL and the later ones. The later ones really evolved well.
    Walt in the West says: Don't ask: "Use the SEARCH Luke"
    1959 190SL DB050 with 333 leather blue ("It's Alive!" - 653 miles) Chassis 14445
    1961 300SL Roadster DB608 with red - fresh brakes and rebuilt engine hung in - more work coming!

  7. #7
    Graham Keene
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    There is that tank color again.
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    Graham Keene
    61 190Sl
    57 220S Cabriolet

  8. #8
    Graham Keene
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    Being able to remove the front fenders is a real advantage for access. Both fenders are in great shape needing no metal work other than some panel bashing. Only two of the blind nuts broke on removal. Undercoating is being removed for media blasting. Opps that is not correct...I guess it will be hand stripped.
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    Last edited by 438998775; 02-20-2008 at 05:23 PM.
    Graham Keene
    61 190Sl
    57 220S Cabriolet

  9. #9
    Graham Keene
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    Niagara on the Lake, Canada
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    And here it is completed. Actually this is how it came. It was a tough call whether to strip her down as the condition was not too bad. I guess I was getting bored and needed another project. I will do the following upgrades:

    Seat belts x 4
    CB headlights
    ignition relay
    passenger blower
    secret radio
    progressive and sport springs
    upgrade insulation
    white walls
    alternator (not sure)
    Starter (not sure)
    oil filter adaptor

    The head is from a 220sb with 2 head gaskets. The head thickness is under 84 mm and thus the reason for the 2 gaskets. I have the original head with some surface corrosion which is why I am sure the head was replaced. Will Samples informs me that this can be fixed (I haven't read all of Volume II yet). As the old head is within spec at 85mm I am in luck. Cylinder block walls look great but will be checked by a pro along with everything else. I am hoping not to have to do a total rebuild.

    I know this ain't a 190SL but any suggestions or advice would be greatly appreciated as I go. You know this car better than you think.
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    Last edited by 438998775; 02-20-2008 at 05:43 PM.
    Graham Keene
    61 190Sl
    57 220S Cabriolet

  10. #10
    RonRapp
    Guest
    Nice!

  11. #11
    Graham Keene
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    Niagara on the Lake, Canada
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    Well the car is now ready for sandblasting, so out she goes tomorrow. We have been waiting for decent weather to get started but up until now have had record breaking snow fall. The idea is to get the car media blasted and a base coat of zinc chromate applied within several hours...weather permitting.

    The crank in the interm was pulled and unfortunately where the rear wick seal hits the crank, corrosion and pitting has formed rendering the crank unuseable. I have purchased a refurb crank -.025 mm. with matched bearings to get it over with. Similar problem with the head...corrosion, but it at least can be repaired.
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    Graham Keene
    61 190Sl
    57 220S Cabriolet

  12. #12
    Registered User
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    Chicago
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    What is the story with the Mog? Got more pictures?
    Dave

  13. #13
    Graham Keene
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    The IMOG isn't mine but what a neat truck. It is being restored by the guys doing my 220S. This thing could eat a house.
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    Graham Keene
    61 190Sl
    57 220S Cabriolet

  14. #14
    Registered User Dave Polny's Avatar
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    Similar Cars

    Graham,
    We are also doing a 1959 220S Cabriolet, It is going to be DB180 Silver Metallic with a Blue interior and Gray piping with a dark Blue Top......Very similar cars, much more chrome and a couple more nuts and bolts...........dave
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    Dave Polny
    Collection Manager
    dpolny@wilson-collection.com

  15. #15
    RonRapp
    Guest
    Dave, the car look really nice, but the wood is to die for. I've always loved the exiotic woods that M-B used. What a shame they stopped.

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